AmeriCAN-DO Attitude

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Debating an Obama-Lover — Part I

This is a “discussion” — to the point that it can be considered as such, considering the Obama-lover’s nonsense — I had with a Facebook friend and his Obama-lover friend regarding Obamacare. This is typical of the conversations I have had lately with Obama-lovers. In the past 2 weeks, I have had a Facebook friend (now former Facebook friend) call me a “Republican racist”, another say I was “ignorant” and now this internet tough guy say I am a “f#cking ret#rd”… all simply because I have been posting link after link, source after source, fact after fact after fact opposing Obamacare and exposing it for the craptacular mess that it is.

People wonder why I have no part of liberals — especially Obama-lovers — in my life, either online or in my real life. Well, here’s a prime example of my interactions with liberals and Obama-lovers:

Letter to cancer patient says her govt healthcare will pay for her suicide, but not her chemotherapy

Source: http://www.katu.com

SPRINGFIELD, Ore. – Barbara Wagner has one wish – for more time.”I’m not ready, I’m not ready to die,” the Springfield woman said. “I’ve got things I’d still like to do.”

Sooner or later EVERYONE gets mortally sick or mortally injured; we all die. Is this the kind of healthcare we want when our life is in jeopardy; govt healthcare? It is if you are a Democrat. Republicans choose life.

COMMENTS:

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN B: sad and scary

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: And most likely untrue.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER, did you watch the news report? Where’d you hear it was untrue? If so, I hope that TV station does a retraction.

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: It’s all bullshit scare tactics.

MICHAEL IN MI: Yeah, Obama and his minions in the media have definitely been using a lot of BS scare tactics with regards to healthcare, that is for sure.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: They don’t say anything about national healthcare in the news report, and I don’t see anything in it to back up the claim that it’s “scare tactics” or even a false report. In fact, they even interview the manager of the program in it.

Still haven’t watched it, eh?

MICHAEL IN MI: Doesn’t matter to the Left, COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A. If they say it is BS “scare tactics”, then it is so, regardless of any facts existing to back up the claim or not.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: Never question The One

MICHAEL IN MI: In the past week, I have been called a racist for presenting the facts about Obamacare and had another liberal say that I was ignorant of the facts. When I presented her with 10 different sources to back up my facts, she said they were Republican sites and she wasn’t going to read them. One of them was a YouTube of Obama’s own words about single-payer and nationalized healthcare. Didn’t matter. I was simply ignorant and she wasn’t going to listen to me or read any of the facts I provided.

My patience with these people is zero.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: Yeah, but this isn’t a report from some right wing site. It’s from an ABC affiliate KATU.

MICHAEL IN MI: You don’t understand Obama-lovers, COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A. And I’m serious when I say this. If a mass media outlet is criticizing The One, they are a right-wing site. I’m dead serious. That is how these people are, at least the ones I have been dealing with the past few weeks. It is beyond aggravating.

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: “Dr. Som Saha, chairman of the commission that sets policy for the Oregon Health Plan, said Wagner is making an “unfortunate interpretation” of the letter and that no one is telling her the health plan will only pay for her to die.”

So is he out and out lying?

This shouldn’t be about left and right, it should be about helping people to get insurance, and basically you’re a #sshole if you think that’s a bad idea. You automatically make yourself look like a f#cking ret#rd when you call it Obamacare, and I think you know that. You’re just not smart enough to give a sh#t.

MICHAEL IN MI: Ah yes, more name calling. Have you even bothered to read the Obamacare bill, tough internet name calling guy?

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: T/F the letter said it would not pay for chemo

T/F the letter said it would pay for suicide

The doc’s covering his ass. They showed the letter.

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: Yes, I have, not-tough internet know-not-a-f#cking-thing guy.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: Fact remains, govt would not pay for treatment, but would pay for her to die or for pain killers till she dies (the Brit and Canadian programs are doing the latter too now)

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: And I believe the doctor when he says she is misinterpreting the letter. It’s no different than Michelle “Batsh#t Insane” Malkin going on tv yesterday and claiming that every 5 years they are going to evaluate old people to see if they should continue to treat them or not. F#CKING LIES. All of them.

MICHAEL IN MI: Yep, and Obama explicitly stated that as well, COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A. He said that people would be told that they probably shouldn’t be given X or Y treatment and maybe they would be better off with just taking a pain killer. That is from the horse’s ass’s mouth himself. Yet genius up there — who claims he read the bill and is so much smarter than dumb*** ignorant me — claims this is all “scare tactics”.

Again, this is the third lib in the past week I have come across who has shown themselves to be a complete tool when it comes to this topic, only having the capacity to name-call. Brilliant.

MICHAEL IN MI: http://tinyurl.com/nl35oy

Obama: “Take a pill”

Yet, I don’t know a f***ing thing. Right. Idiot.

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: I’m 10 times smarter than you, so I feel well within my rights to call you what you are: a f#cking tool.

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: How do you sleep at night, knowing that you are bald faced lying to keep health insurance from people who can’t afford it. Are you proud of yourself for that?

MICHAEL IN MI: You must be pretty smart since you don’t know a thing about me except for a few comments on COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A’s links, YET you just KNOW you are smarter. Brilliant.

Anyway, COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A, here’s a pretty good article on topic here:

http://hotair.com/greenroom/archives/2009/08/03/moving-toward-death-as-the-default-option/

MICHAEL IN MI: Explain the “bald face lie”.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: Ok so….they are gonna pay for her chemo or not? Are they willing to pay for her suicide or not? This isn’t about getting healthcare to 1/7 the US population, but about the extent of healthcare. Obama himself said (as the video shows) it might be more affordable to take a pill than get treatment.

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: I think that her chemo is going to get paid for. I think this is a misunderstanding, and that people who are against the health care plan are using this to scare old people into being against it. You’ll notice that everyone who is screaming the loudest against this are already insured.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: 6/7 Americans are already insured, so that’s not a big leap of faith for a guess. Where did you see she’s gonna get covered?

MICHAEL IN MI: Yeah, 90% of the country has health insurance already. So it’s not a big leap to find people against it when it costs more and makes healthcare worse. Logic would say that 100% of people would be against something that costs more for worse service.

Also, COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A, you may like this about the so-called 47 million uninsured: http://vetsonthewatch.wordpress.com/2009/07/31/47-million-uninsured-americans/

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: I’m all for a 6 month or even a 1yr govt welfare health insurance coverage, but we have that now. I (like Repubs) want to see some reform, but the question I have is why $2TRILLION when $21bn would do the job for that 1/6-1/7 of the nation?

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: You only think it makes healthcare worse. But, if you feel ok about yourself trying to scare people and keeping insurance away from those who can’t afford it, that’s fine with me. I, on the other hand, think that EVERYONE should have health insurance – it’s better for the nation, better for the economy, and morally, it’s the right thing to do. I even think scare-mongering douchebags like you should have insurance. So not only am I smarter than you, but I’m also morally superior.

MICHAEL IN MI: COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A — You may like this article also: http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=31747

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: This report isn’t about the quantity of coverage, but about the quality of it.

-She will not get her chemo paid for
-They will pay for her suicide

that’s the fact about the quality of coverage we can expect from govt programs. Nothing shy of proof she’s going to get her chemo paid for will dispute those facts.

MICHAEL IN MI: What I want is for people to have the choice of having health insurance or not, and to have the choice of private insurance. What I do not want is for people to have no choice but bad government rationing healthcare. I am pro-choice when it comes to health insurance. Government health insurance is anti-choice, driving private insurance out of business and forcing people (1) to have no choice but government insurance and (2) have no choice but to get health insurance whether they want it or not.

And you are neither smarter nor morally superior, you are simply an insecure a-hole who makes himself feel better by tearing others down. I feel sorry for you.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: Enough w the name calling guys. It’s as useful as blaming Bush or whining about Republicans when there’s a supermajority; ie does nothing but distracts from conversation and points

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: Is the lady getting her chemo covered by the govt program?

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: I don’t need to waste my time tearing you down. Smarter, morally superior, and more of a man than you’ll ever be. Find someone closer to your intellect to play with. You’re wasting my time with talking points that you don’t even understand.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: The ABC affiliate video is not a talking point-it’s about a woman w govt coverage who will not get her medical treatment paid for, but will have her suicide paid for. If there’s a report that she’s getting coverage out there, I’d like to see it.

MICHAEL IN MI: COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A — You are correct. With Obamacare, we will have no choice and will be stuck with whatever Obamacare decides for us. With the example of the 105-year old woman, she went to a doctor who said she needed a pacemaker. She wanted it , but the doc said it wasn’t worth it to give it to her, since she was 100. So she went to another doc, he said he liked her spirit and spunk and said he would give her one. 5 years later, she is still going. Obama EXPLICITLY stated that we can’t make decisions on “spirit and spunk”.

So, under Obamacare, that lady would not get her pacemaker. These are not “scare tactics”, regardless of how many Obama-lovers want to call them that. Obama himself stated that doctors will not be making decisions on spirit and spunk. Obama himself stated the goal was to eliminate private coverage and only have government coverage. Yet Obama-lovers say the RIGHT is using scare tactics. I didn’t know using Obama’s own gawddamned words was “scare tactics”.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: The question is simple: is the govt program going to pay for this woman’s treatment y/n? No, but they’ll pay for her to kill herself or to be drugged up until she dies.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: ” I didn’t know using Obama own gawddamned words was “scare tactics”.”

Yes, and it’s often called racist too

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN B: Guys, that’s enough. Let’s all agree to disagree, OK?

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN C: I agree with CSAB. But on one hand the side that does not agree with Obama and his crap is always supposed to just sit back and shut up… hmmm Our soap boxes are not high enough… the bottom line is it is about America! with all due repsect Obama has done nothing for America, Democrat or Republican.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: 38 days until I start using the phrase, “[today’s bad news event] happened on Obama’s watch”

SELF-PROCLAIMED GENIUS OBAMA-LOVER: “with all due repsect Obama has done nothing for America, Democrat or Republican.”

You’re just not used to a President who actually gives a sh#t about Americans that are not rich, white, republicans. You’ll get used to it. You’ll probably even like it. It’s nice when you have a leader who cares about EVERYONE in the country. We haven’t had that since the late 90’s.

COMMON SENSE AMERICAN A: baseless rhetoric that’s counter to his call for an end to the divisive politics of old. If he can’t lead his most devout supporters to follow that simple call, then there’s no reason to believe he’ll ever surpass his Senatorial list of accomplishments

August 5, 2009 , 12:59PM Posted by | Barack Obama, Communism, Debating an Obama-Lover, Fascism, Healthcare, Leftist Groups, Liberalism, Marxism, Socialism | 2 Comments

My First ‘Hate Mail’ – I Feel So Honored

So I have just recently received my first bit of ‘hate mail’. Not exactly hate mail, but more like ignorant ranting mail. Either way, I am honored to have posted something which irritated someone so much that they were moved to write an e-mail to tell me about it. heh

So here’s “Independent” “Paul Be” from norethug08 at yahoo dot com. (Quite the “Independent” e-mail address, eh?):

So let me see if I have this right. Over the last 8 years, we have added 5 trillion dollars to the national debt. We created 3 million jobs, as opposed to 21 million the previous 8.

The national debt was reduced 4 of the 8 years of the Bush Administration. This despite inheriting a recession from the Clinton Administration, the 9/11 terrorist attacks, fighting in 2 war efforts and the Hurricane Katrina situation. I’d say that is pretty damn impressive. Especially considering the average debt was not too far off from the average debt during the Clinton Administration.

You are about to lose your job, and yet, you are focused on why people are attacking rush el lardo??

Um, no. People are losing their jobs, the economy is getting worse and the first thing that our new President did once in office was attack Rush Limbaugh, a private citizen and talk radio host. One would think that the President and his Administration had much better things to worry about than attacking a private citizen. But apparently not. One would also think that the President and his Administration had much more class and dignity and respect for the Office of the Presidency than to use their power to attack a private citizen. But apparently not.

Do you really listen to Rush?

I’ve been listening to him almost every day since September of 2001. I also have subscriptions to his website and The Limbaugh Letter. So, yes, I really do listen to Rush Limbaugh. Do *you*? From the sounds of it, you don’t at all, but simply know the talking points about him from the Left-wing outlets who smear him.

How can a conservative, especially a christian endorse him? Do you dismiss the hateful things he says about women, minorities, etc.?

Uh, what hateful things about women and minorities would those be, genius? Care to provide examples? I know of none. And if he were saying hateful things about minorities and women, I would think that his program guy Mr Snerdly would say something, since is Black. And Dawn, another show employee, would probably say something as well. Or they would both leave his show if he were hateful. But, they remain. So provide some examples or shut the fuck up.

The guy even went after Michael J. Fox. I guess that’s ok, cuz he’s a conservative.

Um, no, he did not, dumbass. Michael J. Fox was lying about stem cell research and using his illness to promote bad policy and lie to the American public about it in order to convince them to vote a certain way on bad policy. Rush Limbaugh called him out on his lies and deception. The fact that you don’t know this shows your utter ignorance.

As for your love of Reagn, a little news flash. He raised taxes and grew the government, BIG TIME. I happen to think he was a terrific president and great leader, but those are the facts.

He cut the federal tax rate from 70% to 28% in order to stimulate investing and job growth. This worked for JFK, worked for Reagan and worked for the Bush 43 Adminisration as well. Despite these facts, the Obama Administration flat out refuses to do this and, in fact, has decided to do the complete opposite in raising the tax rates.

You mentioned you are about to run out of money, cuz you lost your job. A few questions. Conservatives have been bashing the supposed reckless people who bought homes they could not afford. How come you don’t have enough savings to make it longer than to the end of May? Are you going to collect unemployment? Are going to use a free clinic if you can’t afford COBRA? Well according to conservatives, you don’t deserve that. You were reckless… Seems like a double standard to me.

(1) I don’t have enough savings, because I didn’t save enough money the last 5+ years of owning my home. (2) Yes, I am collecting unemployment. (3) I chose not to have COBRA, because I haven’t needed to go to a doctor or hospital in over 15 years. I take care of myself and don’t get sick. So I am *choosing* to not have health insurance. Something the Left and Democrats tell me that I should not have the freedom to do. That’s why they want to push National Healthcare and force everyone to pay for health insurance they don’t want or need.

Explain to me which conservatives are against unemployment and free health clinics, because I have never heard anyone express that before ever. Seems to me you have no idea what is conservatism and no idea what conservatives are for/against.

The fact is that I was not ‘reckless’. I made sure to get a 30-year fixed loan for my home and I have paid my mortgage without issue every month since I have moved in back in 2003. After getting laid off, however, I calculated that I could survive for 7 months on unemployment. After determining that, I did not go whining to the government for a bailout or go bitching to my lender and tell them that I am not going to pay my mortgage, nor did I go to Obama’s radical thug buddies at A.C.O.R.N. to have them help me bully people in order to stay in a home that I can no longer afford. I did the responsible thing and started looking at my options for selling the house, as anyone else should do. That is a bedrock conservative principle: personal responsibility. No double standard at all. I take responsibility for any mistakes I make in life and then work to fix them myself, without blaming anyone else or asking the government (American taxpayers) to bail me out or fix my problems.

As for you being called out as a racist, I don’t know if that’s true. It was curious though, that your post on black five media ended with, well at least he is black… Would you have ever said that about bush?

Why would I say President Bush is Black when he clearly is not? And I don’t know which comment of mine at Blackfive you are so riled up about, but if you are that ignorant to not know about the “My President is Black” movement of the Obama supporters, then you obviously missed my sarcasm. You obviously also missed Uber Pig’s admission on Blackfive that he voted for Obama based on his Blackness. My sarcastic statement that ‘we can not worry about any of the problems in America, because at least our President is Black and that makes it all better’ was making fun of Obama supporters who supported Obama solely because he is Black. And stated that we can now be proud of our country because “My President is Black”. If you truly are that clueless that you don’t know about this, then I’m not surprised that my sarcasm went right over your empty head.

I will say as an independent that the right’s rhetoric is appalling.

Heh, the Right’s rhetoric is appalling. Ah yes. Apparently you had no problem with the rhetoric of the Left of the past 8 years, but now the Right saying they don’t want the socialist policies of Obama and his merry Marxists, that’s appalling. Whatever, buddy.

I was on the fence between Obama and McCain. The Palin pick was a deal killer for me.

So let’s see. There was a choice between a socialist/communist/Marxist racist with no executive experience, no achievements or successes in his entire political life except giving speeches and co-writing a book with a domestic terrorist and whose entire political career was forged with the likes of communists, socialists, Marxists, racists, corrupt pols and domestic terrorists who all hate America and were anti-capitalism. And his VP who is an idiot and who also has no achievements in his entire political career. Compare that to a left-leaning Republican who brought on a running mate who had more executive experience and accomplishments than Obama, Biden and McCain combined, not to mention experience and accomplishments with the energy industry. And yet, the deal killer for you was not Obama’s horrible background and lack of experience, nor Biden’s horrible lack of experience and accomplishment, nor McCain’s policies being basically socialist-lite, but rather the one politician among the two tickets who was most qualified of the 4 to actually govern? Brilliant logic there, genius.

The BS since then is incredible. The right has become about the party of Jesus and Pro-Life. The stock answer is lower taxes. It lacks any intellectual arguments. So keep up your hateful rantings…

The Right has become the Party of Jesus and Pro-Life. Uh, sure thing, bub. And yes, lowering capital gains taxes and lowering corporate tax rates in order to encourage people to invest and businesses to invest and grow and hire people is a pretty much common sense stock answer and a proven successful solution time and time again. No intellectual arguments, eh? You apparently don’t spend much time actually listening to the arguments of conservatives then, because we are the only ones presenting intellectual arguments for successfully fixing the economy. Hateful rantings, that’s a laugh. Take care, Mr. ‘Independent’.

March 9, 2009 , 10:46AM Posted by | Barack Obama, Conservatism, Debating an Obama-Lover, Ronald Reagan, Rush Limbaugh, Socialism, Tax Cuts | Comments Off on My First ‘Hate Mail’ – I Feel So Honored